Comments on: Sun loses a sale

By: Brian Smith

Brian Smith — Thu, 23 Mar 2006 23:04:19 +0000

(Fred Kohout, not Fred Kahout–sorry)

By: Brian Smith

Brian Smith — Thu, 23 Mar 2006 23:03:06 +0000

I encourage everybody to read the “Try & Buy Official Rules” at http://www.sun.com/emrkt/trycoolthreads/rules.html. This is a separate document from the “Try & Buy Agreement”–I believe that Sun created the rules document afterwards specifically to clarify everything.

I know for a fact that the executives (at least) at Sun want the program to run smoothly, because I was contacted directly email by Fred Kahout and he personally pushed my application (most of the way) through the process.

In fact, there are numerous blog postings by people that have received their evaluation systems with apparently no issues (besides the need for a DB9-to-RJ-45 converter). But, so far I haven’t really seen any benchmarks/reviews that are better than the ones that the Sun employees provide on blogs.sun.com. But, I haven’t looked too hard either.

Finally, I recommend that you apply through your company instead of as an individual. It is tempting to apply as an individual because, if Sun let’s you keep it for free, then it is your property and not your company’s property. But, if you apply as an individual then you will have to get the $8,000-$17,000 server pre-authorized on a credit card (even if you wouldn’t use a credit card to purchase it)–see the rules.

By: Russ Danner

Russ Danner — Sat, 11 Mar 2006 17:15:47 +0000

This blog and the fallout that has followed it are troublesome. The blogger is correct. If a company is going to do something out of the ordinary then it needs to be easy to find out the details and everything should be conducted with as much transparency as possible.

The blogger diverges from sanity where he expects something for nothing and a company that is willing to bend over backwards to get it. We all know there is no such thing as a free lunch.

Lets be honest here, this is the same garbage you see in the commercial open source sphere. People want a free lunch and a silver bullet. Neither exists. You need to take the oppertunity that exists, determine if it is the right one for you and leverage it.

Sun should be applauded. Firstly on the fact that they are proving that innovation can be managing complexity and wastefulness. Secondly, they have put the design in the public domain. This is a big business move that will most likely create business and fabrication opportunities that did not and could not exist to them otherwise. Thirdly they are letting people try the server for free for a short while. As long as they do this in the open itâ€™s wonderful. It seems to me Sun and Mr. Schwartz is eager to do better where they have come up short.

Feedback is paramount (both positive and negative) but I would not go after the throat of this company for trying something and being imperfect out of the gate. We have you to thank for your careful observation of what is lacking. Somewhere you walked off the cliff. Instead of helping direct this innovator correct its course (since you seem to have a voice), you have used your voice for curmudgeonry. Thank you for the parts of this blog which are rational and objective.

By: Guy Mac

Guy Mac — Wed, 08 Mar 2006 02:51:04 +0000

I think Elliot has a valid point. What it comes down to is that the server is not free; somewhere down in the fine print it says it’s free only if Sun decides it’s free. Standard deceptive marketing.

By: ux-admin

ux-admin — Mon, 06 Mar 2006 09:40:05 +0000

“The purpose of the offer is precisely to convince people like me who might otherwise buy Dell to consider Sun instead. Itâ€™s not aimed at current Sun customers. Itâ€™s aimed at potential switchers. By that standard it failed.”

The real question Mr. Harold is:

If your mind is already made up about going to Dell, why did you even look at the T2000? Or is this one of those scenarios where you perfer DELL because they sell CHEAP JUNK PCs packed in 1U cases, and you’d actually like to have a T2000, which you can’t afford and were hoping to somehow get for free?

Sure it’d be nice to get a free T2000 — no one disputes that, but the ad says “TRY IT FOR FREE”, not “get it for free”. Technically speaking, since you get to try it for free and then can return it, they don’t even have to put the price up, because you don’t have to buy it. Which you won’t anyway because your mind is made up to get a DELL. So I don’t even understand why you went looking at a T2000, which you clearly say is out of your price range anyway.

And BTW, good luck with that DELL. I feel for you.

By: Dell Online

Dell Online — Tue, 28 Feb 2006 21:06:24 +0000

What a loser!…nothing is free in this world. Especially not a $8K computer. You need to get off your freebie ass and find some real work. Abuse to you aside - Sun is a great company.

By: Anonymous Coward

Anonymous Coward — Mon, 27 Feb 2006 23:24:11 +0000

I am with Eliot on this one… I went to the site too… If a president of a reputable company is offerring a product for free, I expect it to be free… There were no obvious pre-conditions or costs for bringing the product in for evaluation…

It seems very fishy that both the President & the VP of marketing leave comments on this blog… Also not one other comment is in favor of the original post? Looks like a organized cover up operation to me…

By: Tom Hudson

Tom Hudson — Sun, 26 Feb 2006 20:40:57 +0000

Is this guy insane or just thick as a brick? He’s already been told the price of the server yet he keeps writing the price of $8,295. `If anywhere the free trial page had said, this server costs $8,295â€³,`.

And his use of words like ‘dishonest’ is downright silly. Who is going to order something w/o knowing the price?

Try configuring anything on dell.com and the price will randomly changed based on what you checked off and what site your on (home, small/med biz, large biz). I’ve gone back to purchase the exact same machine on Dell.com and it’s taken an hour just to configure the same box for the same price!!!!!

Why not blog about that?

By: Fred Kohout

Fred Kohout — Sun, 26 Feb 2006 18:16:37 +0000

Elliotte - I want to clear up any misunderstanding on the point of publishing list prices. Based on some feedback we had gotten prior to your’s we’re going to publish list prices on the Try and Buy sign up form. We have list prices published on other pages on sun.com, but we didn’t get the data on this site - oversight on our part. We’re starting w/US list but we’ll get to global pricing selection on the site. The same goes for the return shipping - we had already identified that clause on our existing contracts to be changed but it hadn’t been done. It is now. On the issue of legalese…would love not to have it (just like the export control section) but we need to do this because as you say the economics, and legal requirements by the U.S. Gov’t, are different for hardware than for software. .

I’m responsible for the Try and Buy program at Sun so fire away at me if you have any other feedback. In fact, if any other folks on this reply list are having some difficulty working through the program or haven’t recieved a “thank you” email after submit, etc. - let me know. We’re making changes and improvements almost daily because we want the program to work. We’ll be expanding the products available on the Try and Buy program shortly to include the T1000 and our X64 servers.

Thanks for the feedback Elliott!

Fred Kohout
Vice President Marketing
Sun Microsystems
fred.kohout@sun.com

By: Jaime Cardoso

Jaime Cardoso — Sun, 26 Feb 2006 10:03:09 +0000

The practice of putting the price in a different place of where you put the product description is an “industry Standard”. I don’t think it’s right but, it is what everybody does.
A possible defence would be that price changes (a lot) depending on where you are. For an American, store.sun.com may be usefull but, for someone in Europe, having the 8K US dolares price in the agreement would be useless and very confusing in legal terms.
Elliotte, I’m a full supporter of making things easier for customers but, try to see it from the other side. It is assumed that, when you go to fill that form you already made your homework and know what you’re talking about with a T1, features, for what it’s good and bad, … and the price of the configuration you want.
Like I said, for every person that writes a “negative” post, there are thousands that feel the same but don’t say anything so, while I still don’t think you’re right, I think we (Sun and partners) should do something to address the issues you point (and thank you for pointing them). I think it was really cool to have Jonathan Schwartz link to you and actually change the documents you refer on several issues you point out. Let’s see how this evolves, …